Curse

Bobby2 · Oct 26, 2007, 08:12 PM // 20:12

Though I'm only playing GW since after the nerf of [skill]Burst of Aggression[/skill], I have occasionally used [skill]Flurry[/skill] to great effect on my PvP Sin. Damage output, Zealous/Vampiric, yada yada yada IAS = sexy.

Now don't turn this into a Flurry bashing thread as my intentions are constructive in this matter.

The immensely popular SP build uses Tiger Stance. This has always seemed strange to me, its low duration and harsh recharge make it not quite worth it in my mind compared to Flurry. But my question is:

--- If you'd use an IAS for your PvP Sin, which one would it be? And why is it worth the skill slot in your opinion? ---

Yanman.be · Oct 26, 2007, 08:58 PM // 20:58

Flurry because it's the best with MS/DB. Because it's the only one viable? Well....MS/DB doesn't really need IAS, but if you don't need utility, it's great.

Tyla · Oct 26, 2007, 09:22 PM // 21:22

apparently flurry doesnt effect attack skills
also lightning reflexes is good as a sin vs sin encounter counter:P

Sqube · Oct 26, 2007, 09:49 PM // 21:49

I'd use Flurry myself, but I think people don't use it because of that 25% reduction in damage. PvP is all about min/maxing, and losing 1-4 points of damage adds up, I guess?

Stormlord Alex · Oct 26, 2007, 09:55 PM // 21:55

Tiger Stance is better for a spiking kinda 'sin, the duration is long enough to count, and the drawback really is null - if any of your attacks miss in a spike, you've pretty much failed anyway.

And aside from SP-style spikers, I really don't see the point in IAS. I'd much rather have an open secondary for Mending touch or w/e, than waste it on crap like Flurry.

Wyat Hawke · Oct 26, 2007, 09:57 PM // 21:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sqube

I'd use Flurry myself, but I think people don't use it because of that 25% reduction in damage. PvP is all about min/maxing, and losing 1-4 points of damage adds up, I guess?

I think it is more that so few people actually know that it only reduces base damage. They should change the skill inscription really, so more people get it...

*lemming* · Oct 26, 2007, 10:14 PM // 22:14

Flurry does only reduce base damage, but why would you want to reduce your damage at all on a SP spike?

Tiger Stance's 20s recharge isn't much of a drawback for obvious reasons.

Bobby2 · Oct 27, 2007, 06:07 AM // 06:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by tehlemming

Flurry does only reduce base damage, but why would you want to reduce your damage at all on a SP spike?

You misunderstand. This question doesn't just relate to the SP build, but to any and every (edit: PvP!-) Sin build out there.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex

And aside from SP-style spikers, I really don't see the point in IAS. I'd much rather have an open secondary for Mending touch or w/e, than waste it on crap like Flurry.

Hm. My Moebius build runs Death Blossom (pressure damage) and Horns of the Ox (interruption). IAS = very relevant IMO, more so than any crap self heal.

moko · Oct 27, 2007, 09:00 AM // 09:00

IAS screws the KD chain in Ox/Moebius actually.

Stormlord Alex · Oct 27, 2007, 12:28 PM // 12:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

Hm. My Moebius build runs Death Blossom (pressure damage) and Horns of the Ox (interruption). IAS = very relevant IMO, more so than any crap self heal.

... wait... who said anything about a crap self-heal?

Bobby2 · Oct 27, 2007, 03:00 PM // 15:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mokone

IAS screws the KD chain in Ox/Moebius actually.

How? Just mash the buttons early enough, right? Never gave me any problems.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex

... wait... who said anything about a crap self-heal?

You did?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex

I'd much rather have an open secondary for Mending touch or w/e

Stormlord Alex · Oct 27, 2007, 03:04 PM // 15:04

Mending Touch is... a self heal now?

O Rly?

[skill]mending touch[/skill]

jaeharys targaryen · Oct 27, 2007, 03:09 PM // 15:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex

Mending Touch is... a self heal now?

O Rly?

[skill]mending touch[/skill]

its saved me a few times on a BA ranger actually. if it catches deep wound and like, poison, your health can go up a bit
LOL
its a condition removal, anyone who calls it otherwise...
ugh

Coloneh · Oct 27, 2007, 05:22 PM // 17:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

How? Just mash the buttons early enough, right? Never gave me any problems.

no, its to fast.the second KD will hit before they stand up, and if that happens you are wasting a KD.

Sqube · Oct 28, 2007, 12:23 AM // 00:23

I must be misunderstanding you. You're not talking about knocking somebody down twice with Horns of the Ox, right?

You mean MS --> HotO --> MS --> HotO will only knock somebody down once if you have a 33% IAS?

moriz · Oct 28, 2007, 12:29 AM // 00:29

generally, tiger stance is the best for SP sins, and flurry best of mobius+death blossom spam.

there's also lightning reflexes. it's recharge is slower than tiger stance, but the ability to completely shutdown ranger interrupts is a major plus. when i was playing assassins a few months ago, the hardest spike targets were the rangers. not because of their block stances, but because they can nail you in the face with an interrupt in the middle of your combo, and shutting you down for 30 seconds.

Bobby2 · Oct 28, 2007, 12:46 AM // 00:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex

Mending Touch is... a self heal now?

O Rly?

[skill]mending touch[/skill]

I stand thoroughly corrected. Confused with another skill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coloneh

no, its to fast.the second KD will hit before they stand up, and if that happens you are wasting a KD.

It is possible to time your attacks, you don't need to use the full IAS - it just gives you the opportunity to use HotO sooner than otherwise. Without an IAS, an enemy can usually get 1 attack in between KDs. With IAS, it becomes possible to deny them even this.

PS: I was being sarcastic with the 'mashing buttons' part of my last post... it doesn't seem to have come through

EDIT: Moriz, the double effect of Lightning Reflexes might well be worth it on a spike build... I've never tried, but I will.

Omniclasm · Oct 28, 2007, 01:17 AM // 01:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sqube

I must be misunderstanding you. You're not talking about knocking somebody down twice with Horns of the Ox, right?

You mean MS --> HotO --> MS --> HotO will only knock somebody down once if you have a 33% IAS?

I think he means that if he uses an IAS, then he needs to think about what he is doing, which makes him /fail.

X Cytherea X · Oct 28, 2007, 06:30 AM // 06:30

if you are using an ias with horns/moebius, you will have to delay your hits in order to kd with horns everytime... which defeats the purpose of bringing an ias...

moko · Oct 28, 2007, 09:35 AM // 09:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Cytherea X

if you are using an ias with horns/moebius, you will have to delay your hits in order to kd with horns everytime... which defeats the purpose of bringing an ias...

^this.

point of the IAS is to get as many attack skills out of possible, such as MB/DB, not Ox.